CMU's Greatest Export is Jane Street
This post is intended to be the most basic of rundowns in getting a top job offer for Carnegie Mellon SCS freshman.
While the following may sound annoyingly prestige-oriented, and compensation-driven, it is bluntly intended to reflect the realities of an increasingly competitive professional landscape. There is a lot of yapping, beware. Get some Tsaocaa boba and settle in.
About me, for context, I grew up low-income in a suburban town with immigrant parents that never attended high school. I took up to Calc AB in high school, and I only knew basic web development coming into CMU. I graduated from Carnegie Mellon University this semester. My highest offer this year included a total compensation of $550k. I had offers from trading firms, two FAANGs, tiktok.
CMU's Greatest Export is Jane Street
Congrats on getting into SCS!
Welcome to Carnegie Mellon, welcome to the world of tech.
Carnegie Mellon, at its core, controversially operates as an incubator for industry, funneling talent primarily into big tech and finance. Notably, the university's relationship with Jane Street, a premier quantitative trading firm, stands out.
In 2023 alone, at least 15 CMU graduates launched their careers there, attracted by impressive compensation packages and a vibrant kino engineering culture that resonates with the technically inclined students found in SCS. SCS is one of the strongest schools within CMU, where admittance is exclusive (as CMU admits on a college-by-college basis). Students are becoming increasingly drawn to the appeal of quantitative firms like Jane Street.
What is Jane Street?
A lot of my fellow Tartans are attracted to the idea of quantitative finance. The journey begins with a simple choice: research, trading, or development. Each path offers its own subpaths, but all are framed within the context of using sophisticated models and algorithms to navigate financial markets. Choose.
Jane Street, along with other top-tier firms like Citadel, Hudson River Trading, and Optiver, value intuition and skill in statistical analysis and game theory over formal finance education (you can have none, although there are many computational finance classes available to take). They want you to excel in brain teasers like, mental math, algorithmic challenges, and probability puzzles. Preparation resources are abundantly available, including Jane Street's own trading interview guide. Jane Street has been abundantly successful and are subsequently on a hiring spree.
Word on the Street
Most students coming into CMU SCS do not know of quant firms coming in. The popular paradigm of high-paying quant dev salaries is a recent phenomenon. But when they enter, they become enamored in that world. When you walk into the doors of SCS the first time, you're greeted with the Citadel Teaching Commons. Bravo Citadel. Admittedly, it doesn't help that everyone constantly talks about it.
If you hadn't bought into the FOMO yet, you'd inevitably take a few functional programming classes, proceed to ask questions like, 'where is this used in the real world?' Answer: Jane Street. Bravo Jane Street. Do students base their entire careers off whether JS uses OCaml? Yes, yes they do. It's a vibe thing. Wcyd.
Getting the Interview
Most graduation outcomes in quant are from return offers from prior internships. Get an internship. Securing an interview is difficult 😔. You will probably need a prior tech internship or have research experience (or have done competitive programming or maths). I heavily recommend freshman or sophomore year for this. Generally, just shoot your shot. Notably, the application periods for these firms starts early in the summer. Apply early! A caveat is that some firms may frown upon bad performances, so make sure the firm doesn't blacklist before you interview if you're not prepared.
Jane Street recruiters are cracked; they will likely message you the day after you apply if they liked your profile. Some firms are picky, hiring only out of MIT or Harvard. Some firms say they lack recruiting capabilities to interview more candidates (sure, their loss).
Preparation
Leetcode is a requirement. Almost all companies will ask algorithmic-style questions that you will be expected to answer optimally. Do leetcode unless you have a competent background already. Do it consistently.
If you're interested in trading read through one or two of these books thoroughly.
There are a number of useful courses you can take too, both for practical skills and theory. Don't be afraid to take courses that seem harder than you think you can do! Attend office hours, be interested, and you've got it!
The Interviews
Internship loops are difficult to pass. Each interview stage is rigorous: there is an initial online assessment (expect leetcode-hard) followed by a phone (zoom) screen of more algorithmic or probability problems. Success in these rounds can lead to an on-site experience where you will be flown into a five-star hotel, be chaffeured to the office, and then grueled for 4-5 interview rounds, typically concluding with swift feedback (Jane Street in particular lets you know by the end of the day). New grad loops are even more stringent.
Which Firm to Work at?
Jane Street pays a lot and the culture is great. Citadel if you want to grind on a meritocratic basis. Hudson River Trading for a healthy mix. Do your own research, ask around.
CMU's Second Greatest Export is Research
Beyond industry, CMU absolutely excels as a research institution. I would highly recommend students interested in cutting-edge fields like machine learning or robotics to engage deeply with the university's resources, both coursework and hands on research, if possible. I highly respect those who don't sell out (LFG PhDs!).
CMU's Third Greatest Export is Big Tech
While in the past (for devs), big tech was superior to trading firms because of equal pay and better work-life balance, it has swapped ceremoniously. Trading firms pay better and work-life balance is now equally terrible.
But while quant trading firms offer crazy salaries, it is not always the clearest decision. Quant dev compensation can plateau if your team is not adjacent to revenue, WLB can be difficult, remote is unlikely, and you will be a small fish among sharks. Further, if you ever switch to big tech, expect to face a paycut and generally have less experience with quality software systems. Trading infrastructure and algos are beautiful; every other system they use is slop.
But if you cannot or do not want a quant job, go for big tech. I do not know how the job market will look for new grads in a few years (it is terrible now), but I hope it picks up. Even top students I know have had tremendous trouble landing positions. It really just is a number's game.
CMU's Greatest Export is NOT Entrepreneurship
Unfortunately, my time here has greatly disappointed me in CMU's entrepreneurship scene. Bluntly, many entrepreneurially-minded students are the business students and MBAs (when they should be the engineers!). Entreprenshuip at CMU is an unserious endeavor; ideas are silly, efforts are weak. The resources, network, and staying power is not there.
Personally, I am a meek engineer; I am not the type to network and seemingly most VCs have not respected my time or attention. Unlike trading firms, there is an abundance of talent and ideas to fund; you will not get the time of day. Further, the type of cofounder that befits a technical founder is also usually lacking in this institution.
Despite my harsh tone, CMU has made great strides since I was a freshman, and I believe they will do great in the coming years. You, dear student, can make CMU entrepreneship a force to be reckoned with. Especially with our strength in ML and robotics.
Miscellaneous
Is money the end all be all?
No. In fact, I wish I got a single remote position. I would take it in a heartbeat.
How is the time commitment?
CMU's greatest import is talented students.
Now this is unfortunate but to be blunt, the most successful students already have had significant competitive programming or math competition backgrounds or at least had rigorous mathematic coursework in high school (Calc AB/BC, Matrices, Calc 3). It is by no means necessary but by every means easier. Since you're already at CMU, if you don't have a sound mathematical or computer science background, develop one! You're here to learn after all.
Regardless, it is a significant time commitment. I fondly remember frequently making friends and hanging out in the context of problem set struggles together. Fun times. It is up to you whether you want to make that sort of dedication. Anyhow, you'll still have plenty of spare time; I managed to accumulate my Steam account to 5,000 hours of Dota 2! Just enjoy college, learn, and make friends. You'll figure it out in the end.
Is it selling out?
I do find it immensely sad that some of the world's smartest minds are set to work making markets instead of making an impact. At the same time, is it substantially any better or fulfilling than creating shareholder value over at Meta or Amazon? I wanted to pursue a PhD, but the opportunity cost was not worth it for me. I sold out. I suppose I shall spend a lifetime figuring out how I will reconcile that.
The easy way to justify it is that you get to work with brilliant people! College is about the people; why not work? Now, it could very well be that soon Palantir and Anduril are the hottest companies and making weapon systems is cool again, earning you the highest comp. I stop there, personally. Of course, that's not very controversial.
Are there any other fields to look into?
Today will not reflect four years into the future. Trading firm compensation could collapse to pre-pandemic levels, big tech could soar, etc. You could work on next-gen AI systems, robotics, other forms of hardware. Personally, I want an effective combined washer + dryer. Build that! I don't know, I'm not an Oracle (although I have my bets!).
That's all, goodbye and goodluck!
Until an asteroid,
boon